Talk:Good Bye, Lenin!

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Movie Refernces

This section was translated from the German article by a group of English students of the University of Freiburg.

Title

Sorry, I'm not sure how to create a new section, I would just request that the "Analysis" section gets a redo, it's got no clear message and seems to be all over the place in terms of language. Whoever wrote it had a great idea to include it, but it just needs more polish ~ Cheers —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.6.227.169 (talk) 23:17, 31 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Shouldn't this be renamed to "Goodbye Lenin" as per the spelling in the picture? — JIP | Talk 07:07, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I don't think so, if you look at the imdb picture it has a space between good and bye, I think that's the actual name. -- Joolz 17:24, 7 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

If you are going by IMDB, it should be Good Bye, Lenin! [1]. I'm not an expert, but this is also what I would have expected it to be. --68.198.246.166 04:57, 27 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, the title per IMDb is Good Bye Lenin!, three words, all capitalized, no comma. I've moved the article to this title. ~ Jeff Q (talk) 20:22, 28 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The correct title is: - Good Bye, Lenin! - with a comma! See also the official website (http://www.good-bye-lenin.de/) and the German Wikipedia (http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_Bye,_Lenin!). The tracks on IMDb.com is misspelled, see the original trailer on IMDb.com - (http://www.imdb.com/video/screenplay/vi4238999833/) - between 2:00 to 2:04 minutes. Greetings from Germany, ☠ Nobart 20:10, 23 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Removed picture

I had to remove the picture of the poster as it was a PA photo under a very restrictive license and will be deleted (not even available under fair use). Sorry. Justinc 20:56, 26 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Small fact

I just added a small fact with another screenshot. Taking more if it's OK. --User:VJ Emsi 20:14, Januray 4th 2006 (UTC)

Matrix t-shirt

Thanks to whoever edited the part about the Matrix t-shirt, I was wondering about it. --User: VJ Emsi 15:20, January 7th 2006

An allegory of the cave?

We're watching this film in philosophy, and our teacher told us that there are at least 5 references (word) to Plato's allegory of the cave.Is there anyone who can verify that, or is my teacher off in her own little world a usual? (I can think of at least one which is the boy deluding Christiane, his mother, who will suffer a relapse, he thinks, if she finds out the truth...) Bug 20:11, 16 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Did Christiane know the truth?

The article claims that Christiane knew the truth in the end. I have recently seen the film and have found nothing to indicate this. Is there anything to verify this or is this some film fan's original research or hopeful dreams? JIP | Talk 20:20, 6 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's subtly ambiguous, but if she doesn't know the truth, the film makes much less sense. The point is that at the end it's HER that is deceiving Alex; i.e. the reverse of how it starts out. A metaphor for the deception of the GDR's citizens by their own government, but also their own complicity in that deception (and the continuing self-deception after the collapse that the GDR was really alright). Everything in the film that happens on a small scale (the personal events) are metaphors for something that happened on a large scale in world events. Graham 23:17, 6 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I thought the Russian nurse, Lara, told the mother when she goes back into hospital, possibly right before the father visits, but I wasn't paying very much attention.Bug 10:46, 9 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Just viewed it for the first time, and indeed Lara tells her something like, "There is no border! It's one country now!" However, it's not entirely clear if the mother actually understands. She looks quite confused at the time, trying to get a word in edgewise, and once Alex shows her the "newscast" whereby the Sigmund Jähn lookalike announces that he is opening the country to the world, this arguably could have reconciled her understanding with what Lara told her, meaning that the deception worked after all. J21 00:18, 12 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, I have the (German) DVD with the audio-commentary. And the Filmmakers said - she knows the truth - but if someone want to see this different it's no problem. They even shot the last scene with the newcast twice, because they wanted that the viewer see in the eyes of the mother that she knows but don't want destroy the illusion of her Alexander. But the Filmmakers also said if someone will see this different it's realy o.k. - Sorry for my English but I don't want you to die without this information ;-) - Jörn

Thanks I did wonder myself but on the other hand if we are going to speculate on alternative interpretations of events in a work of fiction one could ask could Christiane's initial (1978) illness and subsequent (apparent) embracing of Socialisim actually have been an elaborate ruse to keep the Stasi off their back (and wouldnt the letters from her husband in West Berlin have undermined it) ? 213.40.123.62 (talk) 17:21, 12 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I've seen the German Version and didn't got the picture clearly, although Christina has a big smile on her face looking at her son watching the final fake news. The scenes with Lara are just as described by J21, therefore I wasn't shure. However, Jörns hints are helpful and also Graham's "if she doesn't know the truth, the film makes much less sense". Nevertheless, because it seems the filmmakers intended the ambiguity, I've modified the article like this, hope that's ok. Cyfal (talk) 18:17, 3 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Neutrality

Doesn't seem to be any discussion regarding the neutrality. I've removed it along with a couple of words that suggest the film is great, and I think that removes POV. Liquidindian 10:05, 13 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

References to Stanley Kubrick

There at at least two references to Kubrick movies - the bone scene with the Blue Danube Waltz playing in the background has been referenced explicitly, while the sped up scene with Alex and his amateur actor friend setting up Christiane's bed room (the scene with the William Tell overture) is a clear reference to the quirky sex scene in "A Clockwork Orange." I think it's worth a mention on the main article. Chinmay 09:17, 23 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

There's a third. Alex's friend showed him a cut that he said was supposed to be reminiscent of 2001. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.111.180.97 (talk) 07:04, 25 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Taxi Driver

I might be wrong, so I'm not editing the main page, but I'm pretty sure that the taxi driver is Sigmund Jähn. The article seems to imply that the taxi driver just agrees to pretend to be him. The article on Sigmund Jähn indicates that the taxi driver is him, and although the driver initially says that they just look alike, later the main character asks him what it was like in space or something like that.Britteruci 02:26, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I actually think I was the person to change it so that it was stated like that. The taxi driver when first driving Alex says something along the lines of "I know what you're thinking. But I'm not him." which I took as fairly strong proof that he isn't actually Sigmund Jähn. I always assumed that when Alex later asks him what it was like up there it is just wishful thinking or a bit delusional, like the deception of his mother. It seemed to me pretty clear from the fact that the driver actually says that he isn't that he isn't. If you agree, I will change the Sigmund Jähn article. I'll also double check when I have time, whether the actor is credited as a taxi-driver or Jähn in the DVD. The German wikipedia credits Ernst-Georg Schwill as "Taxifahrer" (Taxi driver in German). Crito2161 04:06, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The relevant line that makes me think that he is Sigmund Jähn is his response to the question "What was it like up there?" He says, "Up there? Oh. Up there. It was wonderful up there. Just very far away from home." It seems unlikely that he would answer like this if he was just a lookalike (although it is possible that he is just humoring Alex). The German Wikipedia article citation seems to match the credit on IMDB, but it seems possible that even if the taxi driver is Sigmund Jähn, he is listed as "Taxifahrer" to differentiate him from the actor playing the younger Sigmund Jähn. It is also possible that there may be a difference between the original version of the film and the English translation. I think that in the American DVD release, most people (at least most of my friends with whom I've spoken) are given a fairly unambiguous impression that the taxi driver is Sigmund Jähn, but this could be different in the German version. If you're citing the original, I'd be interested to know if there is any equivalent to the dialogue I quoted above. Britteruci 20:30, 21 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Good point. Lemme check now. You are correct that I am taking me information from the German release. I assumed that he answered like that to humour Alex, seeing that he already told him that he was not in fact Sigmund Jähn. I'm just looking at it now, and the dialogue goes like this:

Alex: "What was it like up there?"

Taxidriver/Jähn: "Up there?" Then there is a pause while the driver doesn't understand what Alex means. When he comprehends, he says. "Oh. Up there. It was very nice up there. Just very far away from home." (so basically the same)

Based just on the conversation, I might think it possible that the driver was really Jähn. But the facial reaction the driver has in which he doesn't comprehend and then grins a little, keeps me with my original assumption. The credits in the film have completely confused me. They say that Stefan Walz plays "Sigmund Jähn" (quotations included) and Ernst-Georg Schwill plays Taxifahrer. So that clarifies absolutely nothing. I think given all the confusion, we should probably add a line too the summary saying that the movie makes in unclear if the taxidriver actually is Jähn or not 9or something like that). Agreed? Crito2161 20:31, 23 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hopefully my edits are agreeable to you. If there is any problem with them, let me know. Britteruci 23:29, 29 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Could the "Taxifahrer" in the credits have been the one driving Christiane earlier in the film just prior to the riot ?? 80.229.222.48 (talk) 17:43, 27 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, the "Taxifahrer" is the one driving Christiane. --Dresi (talk) 22:44, 3 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Analysis?

I think the "Analysis" section should be deleted. It is unsourced (admittedly, the article as a whole has very little sourcing) and badly written. It contains a lot of irrelevent information, mostly weighing up the pros and cons of socialism vs. capitalism and only loosely connected to the film, and reads like original research. Do people agree that it should be deleted? EttaLove (talk) 16:21, 4 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I would tend to agree. While much of it is interesting it doesnt really belong in wikipedia being too longwinded, unsourced POV and reading like an essay (WP:SOAP) I wouldnt get too hung up on the sourcing for the rest of the article though. The film itself is widely available and qualifies as a source in itself does it not ? 213.40.123.62 (talk) 17:17, 12 February 2010 (UTC)[reply]

awards - Dionysius?

hmm, so we have BAFTA, German Lolas , European Film Academy, Goya , Golden Globe - and what I gather is a podcast talk show award? In the same list, as if it were the same kind of thing. Aryah (talk) 05:38, 22 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. Propaniac (talk) 13:50, 6 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Good Bye Lenin! → Good Bye, Lenin! — Title should be three words, with comma and exclamation mark. Please see the official website (link), Rotten Tomatoes (link), German Films (link), Film Portal (link) and most other foreign language language editions of Wikipedia, including the German site (link). IMDb, which doesn't use the comma, is incorrect in this instance. City of Destruction (The Celestial City) 22:49, 27 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Spoiler Alert!

Hey, no need for me to ever see this movie, now that I know not only it's premise, but also it's ending as well. Where is the freaking spoiler alert warning in the discription - before you ruin the story, folks? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.32.160.175 (talk) 16:31, 29 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The content guidelines do not allow for spoiler warnings (see Wikipedia:Spoiler). Regards. wctaiwan (talk) 08:49, 13 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Factual Error.

In the Plot section it states that Eric Honecker resigned shortly after the wall fell, however he resigned on the 18th of October and was replaced by Egon Krenz. The wall fell on the 9th of November 1989. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rich00cap (talk • contribs) 19:39, 13 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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Michael Nyman

Should we add that Michael Nyman was the original composer hired to compose the score for this film (before he was replaced by Yann Tiersen? 173.88.246.138 (talk) 03:25, 4 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]